Yeah, it would. But nope! Definitely Brian and Justin. I hate it because it's such a pet peeve that it'll completely ruin the story for me. I know it's a small thing and this has been discussed to death, but yeah... I always cringe.
LOL! It's really funny that you said that. I went back today and read a part of one of my Buffy fics and it seems strange to me to see all the british terms. (Oh how I do miss my Spike)
I see them used in QAF fic and it completely takes me out of the story.
Grrrrr!!! You are bringing up one of my pet peeves with this topic. I read some fic about a couple of months ago that wasn't bad at all but it was so hard to stay connected with it because it was full of non-Americanisms. Drives me batshit.
I know! I commented above that this has been discussed many times, but it ALWAYS aggrivates me. I always wonder if people are watching the same show as me. *shrugs*
You know what? Never mind. Just hand over all of your icons, and nobody gets hurt, k?
You know, I can forgive one or two at times. My beloved Suzvoy is so good at taking the Brit-isms out of her fics. Every once in a while, we may get a lift, or post, but I can live with those, cause Suz writes long stories. And if out of twenty odd chapters there's a Brit term that gets missed, I'm not gonna bitch. But yeah.
LOL. I know what you mean about a few here or there. The problem was, I started reading a fic and it was right there at the beginning! Third sentence! I couldn't ignore it!!! *headdesk*
LOL I have a few of these I have learnt to read around them, one of them (which you have done :P ) is when Spike is in a band and the other band members called Charlie etc.. using the band members names from GoTR.
The other one is when Brain uses the term "Luv" in the same manner that Spike would use it or "Pet".
Also when Xander uses the word "Shag" at the begining of a story, if he picks it up or uses it as a joke once Spike and Xander are in a relationship but not at the start.
I could keep going but that would just start to annoy me!
LOL... one of them (which you have done :P ) is when Spike is in a band and the other band members called Charlie etc.. using the band members names from GoTR.
Guilty as charged! I just love Charlie and had to use him! (What's he doing now, BTW? Do you know? A friend of mine used to keep in touch with Kevin, but slowly stopped talking after a while. I don't know what any of the guys are up to anymore)
The other one is when Brain uses the term "Luv" in the same manner that Spike would use it or "Pet".
OMG! I haven't seen that one. I think that would kill me!
I spoke to Charlie the other night. Kevin is working in LA for a recording company, Charlie is still playing with Power Animal, Kevin plays with them now and then, they just had a mini tour with Victim Effect. He is also playing with Metal Falcon and been doing film clips for them etc... (if you go to http://www.myspace.com/booj you can see the video clip for Metal Falcon and Power Animal with out having to log on.) Seemed in good sprits, like any person in a band waiting for the big break and fearing it will never happen or that he lost his chance with GoTR.
Aaron came back from his mission a few years back and I think he got married, he is still their "offical" drummer but I don't think he has played with them for a while. Stephen is still working away doing Gods of The Radio, but I am not sure how that is going music wise, Charlie said he was well when I asked after him. I know that the whole Charlie vs Stephen fandom war really got to both of them and they didn't talk for a while. other then that they all seem good.
But for a totally different reason. Had you not posted this I would never had know that American's don't use "bloody". I hope that I have not been guilty of such an offence, but it is why I always make sure I have an American beta my work. I bet there are a million others I hadn't even thought of.
I have drugs and red wine in my system. I'm feeling a whole lot better because of them, but in truth I'm still just as sick. Tomorrow will be another sick day!
No, no, no, they wouldn't - it's not in their "voices" nor their vocabulary - and btw nor do I, and I'm an aussie. Our Tourism Authority got into heaps of trouble using it in their adverts - in England! of all places...... ♥
Our Tourism Authority got into heaps of trouble using it in their adverts - in England! of all places
That's funny!!!
It's just one of those things. I expect people to know since it's NEVER been said on the show, but it's true... maybe they don't realize. I can overlook it at times, but there are times when it stands out like a sore thumb.
works both ways. fics with english characters full of Americanisms. Like 'he walked a couple of blocks' - err no he didn't! Argh!!!! and whats more, even authors who are aware of the Americanisms and remove them seem to constantly miss the blocks thing.. makes me so crazy!
LOL... I bet we annoy the hell out of the Harry Potter fandom! I couldn't imagine trying to do it.
Someone else brought up that they didn't know Americans don't use the term 'bloody'. You know, that makes sense. Just like I didn't know about not using 'blocks'. LOL.
I guess as long as there's a vast amount of people from everywhere, there will always be this issue. Like Steph said in another comment, I'd have an American read through it if it's not my native tongue. Same for someone from the USa writing english characters. I think that would solve all the problems. *shrugs*
Well it gets doubly confusing for me as I'm Irish so writing in an English fandom, although the language is broadly similar, there are always slang terms that slip me up, or indeed terms that have completely different meanings. Words that are currently in vogue one place but hopelessly dated in another. And that's before you get to specific localities because the way someone speaks in London will be different to Liverpool and Dublin is practically a whole other language, never mind how different age groups will use words.
And it's always the tricky task of not overdoing it, because you can destroy a fic completely by being too heavy with the vernacular.
But its always amusing to read the products and brands that people put in their fic. because you can tell an awful lot about the author merely by seeing what whiskey/whisky she/he has characters drinking...it's the major giveaway every single time!
But yes Beta please, for the love of god! (although betas generally can't catch everything but they certainly can't make it any worse!)
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<i.works both ways. fics with english characters full of Americanisms. Like 'he walked a couple of blocks' - err no he didn't! Argh!!!!</i>
lol QAF is my only fandom ever and I asked whether this was an issue in reverse in the HP or other fandoms. :) I don't get the blocks reference. What should be said?
I do notice sometimes that "road" is used in QAF fic when "street" would be the obvious American choice. We, of course, do have roads here and use the word, but sometimes the way it's used in fic is a dead giveaway that the story was written by a non-American writer.
well you'd never ever use the term block. block as a word confuses me cause i always thought it referred specifically to cities like New york with a grid-layout but i see it used a general measurement of distence? Would that be right?
The closest thing to it I suppose would be up the road/down the road/around the corner
as in the 'The shop was just around the corner' vs 'the shop was two blocks away' but really it doesn't have a specific equivalent.
I think more often than not, it's not so much the use of the specific word but the cultural meanings it implies that are the big giveaways. As in the blocks thing, because Europeans in general don't measure distence like that, with the same exactness I think. And the grilled-cheese sandwich thing (called 'cheese on toast' or a 'cheese toastie' but never ever grilled cheese!) it is often used in particular contexts as a sort of perennial comfort food but it doesn't really have the same kind of meaning on the other side of the Atlantic. (I'm pretty sure I'm not making any sense at all! Sorry! LOL)
block as a word confuses me cause i always thought it referred specifically to cities like New york with a grid-layout but i see it used a general measurement of distence? Would that be right?
This is very interesting! I had no idea block wasn't commonly used as a reference point for indicating place. Yes, it's used a general place-locator as opposed to any exact measurement of distance; i.e., there is no standard foot/meter measurement that equals a block. If you're standing at the edge of a street, the block is the space until the next street, regardless of how long the distance is. Basically, it's corner to corner. So, to me, if I was told the address I was looking for was "two blocks up, turn right and it's almost at the end of the block," that would be a very specific instruction to me to go walk two streets north, turn and walk one street east and the address I was looking for would be almost to the next street corner, even though the distance in feet/meters wouldn't be consistent from city to city (or even area of town to area of town).
Oh, yeah. A grilled cheese and some canned Campbell's tomato soup is one of the ultimate comfort food lunches or dinners. Especially if you're sick or it's really cold outside. :)
I think we're generally a lot vaguer with our directions. but yeah if someone asked me for directions, it would be either in terms of landmarks ie. walk until you get to x and then turn left. or straight ahed and it's the third turn on the right. If i tried to give directions in terms of blocks I'd get someone hopelessly lost, possibly because roads are so 'curved' and converge into so many other roads and with so many laneways it would be absolutely impossible.
Clearly it's a whole different language of communication. Numerous occasions I've been stopped by American tourists in town looking for directions, who look hopelessly baffled when i try to explain, and then when they try to clarify by asking me how many blocks, I then get confused. It is a hopeless business.
Ah, I see you've been reading the same less than stellar fics that I have. I agree with you completely. You're reading along, and suddenly *bloody* pops up and you just stop and say "what?". Back up and read it again, yeah, it's still there. If the story is holding my attention, I'll just try to ignore it, unless it pops up again and again.
LOL. I did manage to ignore it in the story that got me started on this. It's really well written and it's only used 2 times in the first chapter, so I could get past it. But yeah... it did give me that need to try to pretend it wasn't there.
Stuff like that definitely takes me right out of the story. I understand that sometimes people don’t now the differences between terminology, but I’ve read a few fics where Brian and Justin were so clearly British from birth that I just couldn’t get into the story. Yeah, a native beta, for whatever nationality your characters are, is truly a useful thing.
but I’ve read a few fics where Brian and Justin were so clearly British from birth that I just couldn’t get into the story. Yeah, a native beta, for whatever nationality your characters are, is truly a useful thing.
Assuming your American beta has a brain. I've read (or started) several fics that I know were beta'd by an American and were still rife with non-American expressions.
Which begs the question, “What exactly does it take to qualify one to be a beta?” I mean, nobody’s perfect and even the world’s best beta is going to miss things sometimes. But I’ve seen too many beta’d fics where clearly the concept of “beta” was lost on the one credited.
Oh, sure. Anyone can miss a typo. What cracks me up, though, are the fics with v.v. effusive thanks to "the bestest beta EVAR" and the fic is filled with errors, from timeline inconsistencies to grammar to non-American spellings or slang. I'm always left wondering if the beta even bothered to read the fic.
Or if people are so poorly read that they don't actually know certain words or expressions. One phrase that I've come across multiple times in fics is "tidy whities." I can believe that's how someone hears it said, but I can't believe they think it makes any sense. Of course that assumes they are thinking about the meaning... I also saw in a hideous fic Justin and Daph sighing and saying, "Well, Jus, it's a 'doggy dog world'." Now, this may have come from a Snoop Dogg song, I'm not sure, but it just bothered me no end that this girl didn't know from "dog eat dog world."
I have many peeves when it comes to grammar and one of the pettest of those peeves is a lack of commas before or after a proper name or title. There are soooo many fics where those commas are missing that I find myself adding them in when I've chosen to save the fic to my hard drive.
This example refers to capitalization, but could just as easily be applied to commas:
Capitalization is the difference between "Helping your Uncle Jack off a horse" and "Helping your uncle jack off a horse.”
ROFL – And really I shouldn’t, because some of my spelling and grammar errors are truly shameful. But your comment reminds me of this most excellent crack!fic I read awhile back (Gunslinger’s Bride by charley_ryan) which was basically mocking EVERYTHING ever found in bad!fic. And one chapter was completely devoted to the beta issue. A glowing bestest beta ever thank you was followed by truly inspired examples of the most hysterical misspellings and grammar issues.
Sometimes I feel a bit guilty for going off on author mistakes. However, when a fic has been presumably proofread by the author AND by a beta and yet is still just full of obvious errors, I get resentful as a reader that an author wants to be read, but doesn’t take the time to make their work presentable.
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I see them used in QAF fic and it completely takes me out of the story.
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You know what? Never mind. Just hand over all of your icons, and nobody gets hurt, k?
You know, I can forgive one or two at times. My beloved Suzvoy is so good at taking the Brit-isms out of her fics. Every once in a while, we may get a lift, or post, but I can live with those, cause Suz writes long stories. And if out of twenty odd chapters there's a Brit term that gets missed, I'm not gonna bitch. But yeah.
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lol You know every one of my icons is completely up for grabs. Nab all you want. :)
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*snicker*
I know, I know. Justin doesn't have a nice arse, either. Well he does, but...you know.
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The other one is when Brain uses the term "Luv" in the same manner that Spike would use it or "Pet".
Also when Xander uses the word "Shag" at the begining of a story, if he picks it up or uses it as a joke once Spike and Xander are in a relationship but not at the start.
I could keep going but that would just start to annoy me!
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Guilty as charged! I just love Charlie and had to use him! (What's he doing now, BTW? Do you know? A friend of mine used to keep in touch with Kevin, but slowly stopped talking after a while. I don't know what any of the guys are up to anymore)
OMG! I haven't seen that one. I think that would kill me!
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Aaron came back from his mission a few years back and I think he got married, he is still their "offical" drummer but I don't think he has played with them for a while. Stephen is still working away doing Gods of The Radio, but I am not sure how that is going music wise, Charlie said he was well when I asked after him. I know that the whole Charlie vs Stephen fandom war really got to both of them and they didn't talk for a while. other then that they all seem good.
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ARGHHHHHH!!!
Had you not posted this I would never had know that American's don't use "bloody". I hope that I have not been guilty of such an offence, but it is why I always make sure I have an American beta my work. I bet there are a million others I hadn't even thought of.
Re: ARGHHHHHH!!!
Oh, believe me, Steph, I would have let you know!!! LOL
I hadn't really turned the tables to think it's true... some people wouldn't know. (But it still irks me) LOL
Having an American beta solves all problems. It just makes sense.
P.S. How are you feeling? *hands tissue*
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I have drugs and red wine in my system. I'm feeling a whole lot better because of them, but in truth I'm still just as sick. Tomorrow will be another sick day!
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That's funny!!!
It's just one of those things. I expect people to know since it's NEVER been said on the show, but it's true... maybe they don't realize. I can overlook it at times, but there are times when it stands out like a sore thumb.
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Someone else brought up that they didn't know Americans don't use the term 'bloody'. You know, that makes sense. Just like I didn't know about not using 'blocks'. LOL.
I guess as long as there's a vast amount of people from everywhere, there will always be this issue. Like Steph said in another comment, I'd have an American read through it if it's not my native tongue. Same for someone from the USa writing english characters. I think that would solve all the problems. *shrugs*
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And it's always the tricky task of not overdoing it, because you can destroy a fic completely by being too heavy with the vernacular.
But its always amusing to read the products and brands that people put in their fic. because you can tell an awful lot about the author merely by seeing what whiskey/whisky she/he has characters drinking...it's the major giveaway every single time!
But yes Beta please, for the love of god! (although betas generally can't catch everything but they certainly can't make it any worse!)
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lol QAF is my only fandom ever and I asked whether this was an issue in reverse in the HP or other fandoms. :) I don't get the blocks reference. What should be said?
I do notice sometimes that "road" is used in QAF fic when "street" would be the obvious American choice. We, of course, do have roads here and use the word, but sometimes the way it's used in fic is a dead giveaway that the story was written by a non-American writer.
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The closest thing to it I suppose would be up the road/down the road/around the corner
as in the 'The shop was just around the corner' vs 'the shop was two blocks away' but really it doesn't have a specific equivalent.
I think more often than not, it's not so much the use of the specific word but the cultural meanings it implies that are the big giveaways. As in the blocks thing, because Europeans in general don't measure distence like that, with the same exactness I think. And the grilled-cheese sandwich thing (called 'cheese on toast' or a 'cheese toastie' but never ever grilled cheese!) it is often used in particular contexts as a sort of perennial comfort food but it doesn't really have the same kind of meaning on the other side of the Atlantic. (I'm pretty sure I'm not making any sense at all! Sorry! LOL)
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This is very interesting! I had no idea block wasn't commonly used as a reference point for indicating place. Yes, it's used a general place-locator as opposed to any exact measurement of distance; i.e., there is no standard foot/meter measurement that equals a block. If you're standing at the edge of a street, the block is the space until the next street, regardless of how long the distance is. Basically, it's corner to corner. So, to me, if I was told the address I was looking for was "two blocks up, turn right and it's almost at the end of the block," that would be a very specific instruction to me to go walk two streets north, turn and walk one street east and the address I was looking for would be almost to the next street corner, even though the distance in feet/meters wouldn't be consistent from city to city (or even area of town to area of town).
Oh, yeah. A grilled cheese and some canned Campbell's tomato soup is one of the ultimate comfort food lunches or dinners. Especially if you're sick or it's really cold outside. :)
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I think we're generally a lot vaguer with our directions. but yeah if someone asked me for directions, it would be either in terms of landmarks ie. walk until you get to x and then turn left. or straight ahed and it's the third turn on the right. If i tried to give directions in terms of blocks I'd get someone hopelessly lost, possibly because roads are so 'curved' and converge into so many other roads and with so many laneways it would be absolutely impossible.
Clearly it's a whole different language of communication. Numerous occasions I've been stopped by American tourists in town looking for directions, who look hopelessly baffled when i try to explain, and then when they try to clarify by asking me how many blocks, I then get confused. It is a hopeless business.
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If the story is holding my attention, I'll just try to ignore it, unless it pops up again and again.
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~Ellen
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Assuming your American beta has a brain. I've read (or started) several fics that I know were beta'd by an American and were still rife with non-American expressions.
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~Ellen
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Or if people are so poorly read that they don't actually know certain words or expressions. One phrase that I've come across multiple times in fics is "tidy whities." I can believe that's how someone hears it said, but I can't believe they think it makes any sense. Of course that assumes they are thinking about the meaning... I also saw in a hideous fic Justin and Daph sighing and saying, "Well, Jus, it's a 'doggy dog world'." Now, this may have come from a Snoop Dogg song, I'm not sure, but it just bothered me no end that this girl didn't know from "dog eat dog world."
I have many peeves when it comes to grammar and one of the pettest of those peeves is a lack of commas before or after a proper name or title. There are soooo many fics where those commas are missing that I find myself adding them in when I've chosen to save the fic to my hard drive.
This example refers to capitalization, but could just as easily be applied to commas:
Capitalization is the difference between "Helping your Uncle Jack off a horse" and "Helping your uncle jack off a horse.”
:DDDDDDD
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Sometimes I feel a bit guilty for going off on author mistakes. However, when a fic has been presumably proofread by the author AND by a beta and yet is still just full of obvious errors, I get resentful as a reader that an author wants to be read, but doesn’t take the time to make their work presentable.
~Ellen
PS – You have the best icons ever! :D